Tuesday, April 21, 2009
BULLPEN ISSUES.
Driving home from Connecticut on Sunday, I got to listen to the last couple of innings of the game. One of the things I heard Howie mention was that the Padres were going to issue a formal complaint to MLB about the new bullpens, because they couldn’t see what was going on on the field from the bullpen.
As a reminder (and for those of you who haven’t been there yet):
[You can see the super-large version at this link.]
This isn’t just about the tarps on top of the Mets bullpen (which also don’t seem to make any sense - what’s the point of this bullpen setup if you’re just going to cover it up), but there’s also the advertisements, and the fact that there are three layers of chain link separating the Visitor’s bullpen from the field. (This photo and this one from our tour give you the up-close-and-personal view that the visiting team is confronting.
[more after the jump]
From Buster Olney’s blog from 4/19:
Between the signage on the outfield fences and the fact that there are two chain-link fences between the visiting relievers and the ballpark, opposing relievers say they simply cannot see the field—except for a small corridor of the right side. Some of the relievers report that they’d be OK with that if the television screen they have in their bullpen had a feed that showed them the game in real time.
“It’s the worst [visiting] bullpen in baseball,” one Milwaukee reliever said. “You’re sitting there trying to get a feel for the game, a feel for what’s happening, and we don’t know what’s going on. You hear the crowd react, and you watch the first baseman and the second baseman and try to figure it out, and then you wait for the [delayed] feed.”
The Mets alerted the Brewers ahead of time, before Milwaukee arrived, about some of the kinks that they are trying to get worked out—which are typical problems that arise every time a new ballpark opens.
Here’s my thing: I get that there are kinks that have to be worked out. You can’t move the bullpens, or change the setup now. But removing ads and tarps doesn’t seem to be a difficult thing.
Honestly, I’m not meaning this as a “AHA! SOMETHING ELSE WRONG WITH CITI FIELD!” post. Just found it interesting, because I know that we can’t see in there any more to see who’s warming up, that Gary/Keith/Ron have mentioned that they can’t see in either, and now to hear that the visiting teams are also having issues - to the point of filing a formal complaint - just seemed like something interesting to discuss.
I will say that I don’t think the attitude of “THE BALLPARK IS PERFECT AND GORGEOUS - SHUT UP ALREADY” is helpful, nor do I think the “THE WILPONS ARE TOTALLY BAD AND EVIL AND HAVE RUINED METS BASEBALL FOREVER” attitude is the right one either. You can enjoy the place and have a good time while still pointing out that there are some issues. Or at least that’s what I want to do here.
Posted by Caryn at 05:07 AM
Maybe I just have a bit of an evil streak, but I kind of like the idea of making the visitors’ bullpen as unpleasant as the rules allow. Any little legal way to obtain an edge could make a difference. Of course, I doubt that was the intention here, but hey, when the stadium architects give you lemons, why not make a lemon meringue pie?
The ads on the fence will be gone because ultimately that is what blocking the players view. My theory is that the tarps are there to protect the players from Phillie fan and his energizers. The Phils after all do make four visits to flushing each year and their fans are, in general, degenerates. So in order to make up for this design flaw they put in those tarps up. I would be surprised if they were plaining on replacing the tarps with glass or maybe a net. Maybe thats just my optimism that they would do something correctly when addressing the design flaws that are invertible. My fear now however is that since the ads on the fence are going to have to come down, the white tarps will become adds to make up for the lost revenue of the Lincoln and Xerox ads.
My glass is half full thought for today: At least we don’t have a gale force jet stream trough the right side of our new park.
Jessica, I’m with you - but I think there’s a line between uncomfortable and stupid. Arlington and Cincinnati have the same kind of bleak, isolated, nasty-looking visitor’s bullpen that can’t be pleasant to work in…but it has a clear view of the field. There aren’t three layers of chainlink fence that are blocked by two large advertisements.
I think visual access is okay to provide to the opposing team and doesn’t give them that much of an advantage. But everything else? sure, make ‘em sweat, put them up top near the fans, etc.
Not for nothing though the plans including the bullpens would have to have been approved by MLB ages ago. Visiting teams had a chance to look at them. Now they want to cry in their coffee tough noogies.
With respect, I don’t think that Buster Olney and Howie Rose would have mentioned it if those seasoned professionals didn’t think there was some merit to it.
And unless you are 100% conversant with the MLB approval process, I am not certain your statement is true.
I knw they had years of preparation to make this place, there’s been a week’s worth of games played in it so far. Seems like it’sa work in progress.
They put the product out there, let the fans, players and media give it the once over, and file their complaints/concerns. Some they’ll fix (the bullpens), some they won’t (I assume the black wall instead of blue), some they flat out can’t (“obstructed view” seats). But I’ll at least give them a full season to work everything out before really being able to give a full opinion on the place.
I’m not all that concerned about the opposing bullpen’s gripes, but there is something that I don’t think anyone has mentioned thus far and that is what will happen when or if a bench clearing brawl breaks out and the bullpens enter fromt he OF. This could make for some interesting viewing.
I think everyone is misinterpreting that I care what the opposing team thinks. I don’t. I care that this is a highly functional aspect of the ballpark that seems to be yet another thing done wrong.
I also care about what happens to my team when it goes elsewhere and who might now be the subject of any kind of subtle retaliation because of their crappy home bullpens. Kind of like a football team turning off the heat on the bench of the opposing team in the middle of the winter.
The ads are an issue but they should put live feed in both bullpens. I’m sure it will be sorted out.
As far as the tarps go, they’re not for the very few Phillies fans that come up. Mets fans are relentless in their verbal abuse and it wouldn’t surprise me if that’s a reason. I was in Washington next to the Mets bullpen last year and the abuse Met fans were giving Heilman was embarrassing. I never expected that behavior from Mets fans on the road. Usually we are very proud and unified in the other ballparks. Us vs. Them. At home it’s much worse for the ballplayers. This tarp is for us I think.
BTW- Metsgrrl, nice site. I’ll bookmark it.
well, let’s admit it: the bullpen setup is a huge mistake. i mean, yeah, why the f**k those covers? so the fans can’t feed the relievers? and like it’s been pointed out by many, why are those 2 pens side-by-side?? my 5-year-old nephew can easily imagine what’d happen when there’s a bench-clearing browl. it’s gonna be the most awkward moment in the baseball history…. although it’ll be super funny watching it
I think the tarps are there to protect pitchers and catchers warming up in the bullpen from being hit by a potential home run ball. As for the TV feed, I can’t imagine a perfectly live feed being possible. Video has to travel from the camera to the truck, to SNY, then to the TV in the pen. It’s bound to be a couple of seconds slow.
its kinda delightful that these are “bullpen issues” we have to worry about this year…
Philly doesn’t have tarps on their bullpens and the visitor’s bullpen is VERY close to the fans.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2243/2433271456_3493aec15e_m.jpg
I know I had a slight zoom, but I shot that in Philly. We had a whole conversation with Guy Conti after Johan was done, just talking in a normal voice. So the whole “it’s to stop home run balls” is bs as is the need to protect the players. THEN DON’T HAVE AN OPEN BULLPEN.
You know what things you worry about after the stadium is open? You worry about the ad placement on the Diamondvision, or things that don’t directly impact the players.
Matt, that’s funny.
I think it’s a simple fix: take the ads down, remove the tarp and put a big monitor in the bullpen so they can just watch it like people at the concessions.
Ten bucks says this is all done by the next home game. I could do it myself with wire cutters and a trip to Best Buy.
after looking at seating charts of citizens bank and few other parks newer parks i take back my theory on trying to keep fans away from the players… i really wish i knew what purpose those tarps serve… they are hideous…
I think the bull pens should remain the same but where the 378 sign is have benches for the visiting teams pitchers can sit that is seperated from the Mets bullpen. With the there should be a direct route back to the visiting bullpen to relay anything going on in the game.
sorry for the really bad grammar on the last post.
TV games are shown with a slight delay—don’t know how long, but it’s easily visible if you watch a game with the sound off and the radio on (which I did more times than I care to recall during the Fran Healy era); the radio play-by-play is ahead of the action, which is kind of eerie.
This is undoubtedly to give the directors a chance to react if something unusual happens (fan stupidity, natural disasters, really gross injury.)
My guess is that they could route a live feed but for convenience’s sake they just pipe in the cable feed.
So seriously, just take down the ads. Though given how many premium seats are unsold, I guess they’d have to carve the Nike swoosh into the outfield to make up the lost revenue :)
Hey Caryn, I noticed on TV that they took the Lincoln ad off the bullpen for the Nats game, but they’re not relenting on removing the other ad lol. Is it any better now? It seems that those make shift tarps need to go to really get a good view of the pen.
they did take off the lincoln ad. apparently they talked about it tonight during the game? it was easier for us to see who was warming up, and it has to be easier to see the field, but we’re still talking about 3 chain link fences.
the tarps have got to go.
Later on in the broadcast after I wrote my message, Keith and Gary were talking about how hard it is for them to see who is pitching in the visitors bullpen, and that the Padres put in a formal complaint regarding their lack of view. You kind of have to laugh at the camera angle SNY has through the chain link fences for the visitors bullpen, it looks like youre about to watch a UFC fight lol!
Maybe I just have a bit of an evil streak, but I kind of like the idea of making the visitors’ bullpen as unpleasant as the rules allow. Any little legal way to obtain an edge could make a difference. Of course, I doubt that was the intention here, but hey, when the stadium architects give you lemons, why not make a lemon meringue pie?